Taoiseach hasn’t read Lisbon Treaty
May 13th, 2008 by EoinBrian Cowen hasn’t read the Lisbon Treaty! OK, that’s a little harsh, but did say he hasn’t read it cover to cover while insisting he does know what’s in it.
You can hear the full interview here.
I for one am very disappointed to hear out new Taoiseach say he hasn’t read the treaty in full when he has made getting it passed his number one priority. I listened to the full interview and am still none the wiser about the treaty. All i heard from Cowen was the same old “political repercussions.” It’ll take more than vague threats to make me vote yes. Where’s the explanation of what the treaty is about Mr. Cowen? Where’s the consideration of the consequences of getting the treaty wrong? For us and for the EU!
Taking an “if it’s not broke, don’t fix it” approach I am waiting to hear what in the EU is broke and how we need to fix it before I would even consider voting yes. I haven’t read it but I know the EU won’t be happy if we don’t pass it doesn’t convince me I’m afraid.
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May 13th, 2008 at 4:31 pm
If we do vote no, that vote wont be for keepsies. We’ll just wind up having to keep voting until we get it right. Like last time, remember?
May 13th, 2008 at 4:45 pm
I do remember. I’d expect the EU would want this passed eventually, but if we vote no maybe we can force them to change things or at least explain it better.
Maybe this time we should keep voting no until they do explain it properly and if they don’t explain it properly vote out those who don’t!
As voters we must learn from our mistakes or keep facing the same problems.
May 13th, 2008 at 4:53 pm
I wasn’t advocating jumping directly to the yes vote.
Just highlighting the bizarreness of having a vote overturned, simply because it didn’t suit the powers that be.
May 13th, 2008 at 4:55 pm
Yes, how we ever let them away with that and then re-elected them is beyond me. History will laugh at us for that I’d say.
May 14th, 2008 at 12:01 am
Forgive me for being cynical but…
It seems that while people are willing to accept at face value every single mad notion thrown out by the no side they also want to be hand held through the treaty (which is after all a complex legal document) and have every point and nuance of language explained to re assure them beyond a reasonable doubt that what ever the perceived ill that it cannot come to bear!
Be honest… 6 weeks ago did you know how many MEP’s we have, how many commissioners made up the commission… who is our commissioner?
Do you even know now?
Read the thing… if you don’t understand something and there will surely be something in there… read one of the independent guides not something from either side!!!
May 14th, 2008 at 12:56 am
Dave, it’s funny you should say this because I had a good chat with Martin in Tescos the other day when we bumped into each other… I said to Martin what I say to you now -
I don’t trust the no campaigners and I don’t trust the yes campaigners. I don’t know enough about how Europe works, or even how Ireland works to make a call on it myself, and the treaty affects so many issues that everybody will find something to dislike in it.
The government has failed, so far, to present to my satisfaction unbiased material which makes me want to vote yes, and finally and most importantly under the previous circumstances, a huge portion of the ‘Yes’ material so far seems to revolve around the political equivalent of emotional blackmail - ‘look how good Europe has been to us, don’t upset them by voting no..’.
As a result the question I have to ask myself is, do I trust this government enough to follow their advice to vote ‘Yes’.
The answer is No.
May 14th, 2008 at 1:17 am
What is it you are looking for Frank?
The treaty reforms how they make decisions… all laid out clearly in more than one location by yes, no and neutral campaigns… there is also a charter of fundamental rights… again freely available and easy to read…
That’s it in a nutshell… Now I sure as hell don’t trust the Government. But I do think that what we are being asked to pass in this referendum is acceptable.
When the Yes side goes on about how good the EU has been to Ireland it is by way of showing us the CV- so to speak- of the EU as it relates to us. This CV is a good one. We have done well… I think we will do well attaching ourselves to the EU going forward.
It’s not to avoid pissing them off. It’s not to avoid looking bad… It just makes sense to get the treaty passed and get the EU working more effectively so that we can all life in a better more answerable more transparent union.
May 14th, 2008 at 1:19 am
However “mad” the notions of the no campaign are I would say the burden is on the yes campaign to prove that things need to change. It’s not necessarily that I believe what I’m hearing from the No side.
I don’t know how many MEP’s we have or what goes on in Europe. Until I do I’m not going to sanction any more treaties. If our government and MEP’s aren’t doing enough to educate someone like me - who watches at least one of the RTÉ news programmes per day and reads the odd newspaper, then quite frankly they’re not doing their job and are either incompetent or untrustworthy.
May 14th, 2008 at 1:21 am
Dave take a listen to the Cowen interview I linked to above. He doesn’t say what the treaty is about and does say we should vote yes so we don’t look bad.
May 14th, 2008 at 1:31 am
“I think we will do well attaching ourselves to the EU going forward”
Eh.. we are attached to the EU going forward. Whether we vote yes or no. Or am I missing something?
Maybe you get the Treaty Dave, but you’re in the minority.
The rest of us are nervous about a gazillion things which we don’t fully understand, and quite frankly we’re not sure anyone understands.
If finer minds than mine can argue over the what the treaty means for Ireland then I’ll wait until the language is clearer.
Check out my comment on your previous post for just one example of something that makes me nervous about the treaty.
What am I looking for?
What about a real effort to begin to educate the people in proper time to make an informed decision?
Why are we only hearing about Fianna Fails commitment to begin a Yes campaign now?
Why isn’t the government making as much effort to produce it’s unbiased material - the leaflet I received was a fairly half hearted attempt. I don’t know much about Europe or politics but I’m not thick either, and I learned very little from it.
Anyway, what am I still doing up???
Goodnight!
May 30th, 2008 at 1:36 am
[...] Vote of confidence is hard to give when our Taoiseach had not read the Lisbon Treaty fully despite the fact that getting it passed was his No.1 [...]
June 10th, 2008 at 11:00 am
Why isn’t the government making as much effort to produce it’s unbiased material - the leaflet I received was a fairly half hearted attempt. I don’t know much about Europe or politics but I’m not thick either, and I learned very little from it.
Because we are not allowed to have an easily readable copy of it until after the vote what does that say. One more question we should be asking is why we and the other countries have to increase our military capabilities. Like was said above i dont know much about Europe or politics like a lot of people but i am not thick either and something here stinks. I dont have time at the moment to point out all the things that i think is wrong with this treaty. But i will say would you sign a leagally binding contract without knowing every point in it and how its going to affect you and your family.
July 4th, 2008 at 12:03 am
[...] he hadn’t read a treaty he helped to negotiate didn’t exactly inspire [...]